This is Gollum's Typepad Profile.
Join Typepad and start following Gollum's activity
Join Now!
Already a member? Sign In
Gollum
Never-Never Land
Recent Activity
My guess about why suicide hotlines have been blocked is that those who are raped and/or abused are going to be liable to depression and might then phone one of these lines. If they do so, the counselor might well encourage them to contact the police and report the matter. Consequently secular authorities may become involved and this puts a limit on the rabbinical tyranny.
1 reply
With pleasure.
1 reply
On the contrary, it sounded like you were feeling the way I feel when I am very down, so I tried to cheer you up a little when I said: 'When one can't see any good at all, that is a very particular suffering...' Usually I appreciate it when people try to make me feel better, even if the attempt is not successful and is misguided. I still appreciate it that they care enough. As a result I resented the sarcasm when you responded this way: 'Well, Gollum, I'm a little eccentric. When a child starves to death or a girl has her genitalia mutilated (or animals are left to starve to death in the hot sun), it casts a pall on my day.' That is sarcastic, and you are accusing me of being insensitive. I denied the accusation, but I agreed with your theological conclusion: 'There is this, and lots of it, and some even worse. Thats one of the reasons I cannot believe in a monotheistic - type god.' But I also tried again to suggest that there is also some good - because when everything seems utterly dark people usually feel very bad. Also their outlook cannot be realistic just because there are some good things. In return I got a really indifferent dismissal: 'Yeah, whatever.' And the suggestion that I was not understanding your point: 'Gollum, as I said earlier - that IS the point.' I felt like I was being insulted and reacted sarcastically, myself. No, I don't feel threatened and no, I was not trying to invalidate you; as I said before I was trying to help and even if I wasn't able to help, I still didn't think I deserved to be insulted. Anyway, I am a latecomer here, so I won't make any more comments. I wanted to engage in dialogue in a constructive way, but perhaps this is not the right forum. Sorry I have upset you; it was not my intention.
1 reply
'Gollum, as I said earlier - that IS the point.' Sorry, I obviously missed all kinds of profundities here that must have gone over my head. I'm still working on the: 'Yeah, whatever.' response.
1 reply
'So, as I say, if I'm alive next year at this time, either the tradition is false, or God is a liar as well as a psychopath.' Whats this about? Did you not get the news? The Jews were not in Egypt; it follows there was no revelation at Sinai. There are multiple inconsistencies in both the tanach and talmud. We are able to ascertain that the Rabbis knew no more, and sometimes even less, about the world than the rest of their generation. What is the point of your experiment?
1 reply
There is this: 'When a child starves to death or a girl has her genitalia mutilateor animals are left to starve to death in the hot sun' There is this, and lots of it, and some even worse. Thats one of the reasons I cannot believe in a monotheistic - type god. But there is also the unbridled joy and enthusiasm that my dog shows when I take him for a walk. I'm not saying that such things outweigh the bad - just that any balanced view needs to incorporate both.
1 reply
So Moisheb, it works like this: 'the last thing someone wants is to see his face on failed messiah,It scares people more than getting arrested so this site actually helps our community.' And anything that helps 'our community' is good, aka - it's good for the Jews! (read haredim) But, maltreating animals is: 'a frivolous charge ', presumably because a chicken is not a Haredi Jew? So it is anti-semitic to criticize anything UNLESS its bad for the Jew. Gotcha! Sounds like a fine moral system to me...
1 reply
There is lots of horror, and suffering, and posing a benevolent creator is callous just because of this. But, there is also pleasure, happiness and satisfaction. Consciousness in itself is something wonderful to contemplate. When one can't see any good at all, that is a very particular suffering - and if it persists for too long - one worth getting treatment for.
1 reply
Nothing like an orthodox rabbi to instill a sense of tolerance and pluralism, lol! Whoever comes up with these things REALLY needs to read some pages from Daas Emet.
1 reply
Cool video! It makes it all look so much more libidinal and exciting than it is in reality (dreary, blind and complacent cruelty) Someone pass me a chicken! lol!
1 reply
Revised heading: Rabbi goes against god's creation, internet insists. Far more believable, no? As for the Malkot; I'm not sure I find it that shocking. Consenting adults, etc, etc. most religions have an ascetic dimension; and if its sadomasochism, all the better, at least someone is getting pleasure out of it! But leave the CHICKENS alone!
1 reply
To some extent I agree with Moisheb: the meat industry as a whole is so horrific that it probably makes this travesty look small. And Kashrut ways of slaughtering, despite the orthodox propaganda, induces even more suffering than the modern secular method:( More needs to be done to outlaw such horrible methods. The problem is, when this is brought up, suddenly freedom of religion becomes an important value to the Chareidi! No, you don't have the right to cause unnecessary suffering to other conscious beings - either your own children or to helpless animals that you have in your power. If you worship a god who wills more suffering than is strictly necessary - I have news to you - your god is a devil.
1 reply
The post is taken from an article in the Jerusalem Post and is written by Rabbi Eli Kavon. Shmarya has attributed it at the top! So it seems his defection is not entirely genetic, lol!
1 reply
On the contrary, self-preservation is a law of nature. Every conscious being regards it as such. Those principles that lead us to care for others (not just ones family, or exclusively ones own tribe), only such principles can be considered 'holy'.
1 reply
Menachem, on your view the following statement reflects an admirable and holy sentiment: 'As long as they are killing each other they can not be killing us; so, more power to them.' The rest of us here find this kind of thing cynical, and in the context of a spiritual tradition, truly perverse. That is the difference between you and your opponents. Your opponents look at the content of the tradition and know, by the light inside them, that this way of thinking is base, revolting and to be condemned. All sorts of chicanery and false philosophy has been used on you to convince you that you have no internal light and that you are entirely dependent on these texts for any sense of morality. I assume that is why you feel the need to defend a doctrine which cannot be defended on the grounds of decency, let alone holiness.
1 reply
Menachem: 'As long as they are killing each other they can not be killing us; so, more power to them.' It sounds like you may be in line for the Nobel Prize for Peace! Anuran, your grandfather sounds like a wonderful man; and I'm sure there are many instances in which Torah (and religion in general) has motivated people to do great, kind and loving deeds.
1 reply
Anuran, we are basically on the same page. In my first response to you I was pointing out that an anti-semite hates all Jews (as a race) and is not merely opposed to an odious doctrine (that many Jews, like you and me oppose anyway). Immoral laws in any ancient texts do not justify the hatred of a whole race of people - especially if many of them are opposed to the text anyway! This could have been used to cause anti-semitism and fuel it - but it does not logically justify it. In my second response I was reacting to your strong polemical language: 'Can the sophistry and thumb-dipping, the tortuous logic and screeches about "Blood Libels". Your kind has cried "Wolf" too often. ' A garish caricature which is reminiscent of much anti-semitic propaganda. 'This is the simple truth of your version of Judaism.' Actually, I can't be bothered to hold a version of Judaism - I'm attached to neither the religious doctrines nor the culture. And like you I actively oppose the Haredi version for obvious reasons... Hope that cleared things up!
1 reply
Sorry, i know this is a little off topic, but does anyone know whether the footage that peta took at Agriprocessors is representative of all, or most kosher butcheries?
1 reply
If someone would only swing Rabbi Brown-Beard, in the picture, by his legs it might help his blood reach his brain.
1 reply
Anuran, no, I'm afraid you are bullshitting yourself here: there is 'tortuous logic' and there is clear thinking. The concept 'Judaism' is allowing you to conflate entirely different things: the Jewish people as a race (genetic, if you like), Jewish culture (eating caneidalach) and Jewish Religion. As in Christianity there are various forms (Catholic, protestant, etc) so in Judaism there are variations. Some types of Judaism (the religion) claim that those texts do reflect the prejudice and bigotry of the times. These groups believe that religion is something that needs to evolve. Furthermore, your phrase 'your kind' is worrying. It reflects the same us-them mentality as these texts represent. 'Can the sophistry and thumb-dipping, the tortuous logic and screeches about "Blood Libels". Your kind has cried "Wolf" too often. ' You sound like you have stepped straight out of the 3rd Reich: this kind of hysterical and grotesque rhetoric doesn't impress anyone here. Whether it comes from Jews who despise 'goyim' or 'goyim' who despise Jews it all comes out sounding like the same hate-dreched drivel.
1 reply
It is my understanding that according to Haredi Judaism - or at least according to what is taught at Neve - Ohr Sameyach's sister - the further we move from Sinai, the more degraded we become. It follows that what we see as moral progress, they see as regress. The further back we go (to the supposed Sinai revelation) the holier we were; the greater our spiritual and moral stature. The whole idea of Rabbis 'coming around' or 'beginning to see' goes completely against the grain of their philosophy. It is not just their way of dress that has been frozen but their entire outlook which is trenchantly opposed to change. The absurdity of deciding how to deal with certain crimes by considering whether the Rabbis of old would sentence the accused to be put to death, stoned or simply flogged is utterly backwards. Even if the sentences were never carried out, the general paradigm is flagrantly primitive.
1 reply
'Is this true? If it's not, the people reading should have torn him a new one. If it is, the antisemites are right, and the Jewish religion deserves to be obliterated' Well that way of thinking is nearly as crude as the torah. Anti-semites hate all Jews, but only a portion of Jews are so morally regressed that they believe in their own racial superiority! Yes, those who believe God said all this on top of a mountain, or through the mouths of medieval 'sages' tend to be somewhat arrested...
1 reply
There has to be an unbroken tradition from Sinai! How else would all these people know that swinging a chicken by its legs is the best way to proceed? Modern battery conditions, with the artificial fattening of the chicken breast, ENSURES that most chickens endure chronic leg pain. It follows that this tradition MAXIMIZES the chickens' pain. Wonderfully sadistic, B"H
1 reply
And for more warm fuzzies from The Torah visit the Daat Emet page on Gentiles in halacha!
1 reply