The lesson the West took fromIraq and Afghanistan, applied to Libya and is now looking to apply elsewhere.

Hi Bill, This planet. The "intervene without involvement" paradigm set by Libya has had a lot of play in the foreign policy set. Iraq and Afghanistan? Pshaw, those were last decade's model! see "A new era in U.S. foreign policy" by Fareed Zakaria. "What the Libya intervention achieved" by Marc Lynch. And a whole load more with just a quick search. And a sceptic: Intervention without responsibility Regards, Steve

Bill, just seen your comment on Agonist site issues. There's not a lot I can do about it immediately but we're working on a full site facelift and revamp that will solve it along with other problems so I can only ask for some patience. Thanks. Steve

Terrible news. Poor James, a good friend.

Charles and Ron, We touched on this question in the show last night, and we'll be revisiting it in later shows. At the end of the day, it's the one question that really matters. For myself, I don't see an alternative to trying to convince people to organize nationally but build locally (from dogcatcher on up), and assuming for the sake of samity that the world isn't going to end in the next decade. Suppose we didn't plan for the long term, thinking "A decade from now, we may no longer exist, the world may no longer be habitable, and there may be no right to dissent" and then the long term happened anyway. We'd be in the same or worse fix. Halting the American penchant for short-termist thinking, magical solutions and messiah political figures has got to be part of the solution. Regards, Steve

Indeed, Lex. Hedges, in the piece I linked above, writes: "Liberals bow before a Democratic Party that ignores them and does the bidding of corporations. The reflexive deference to the Democrats by the liberal class is the result of cowardice and fear. It is also the result of an infantile understanding of the mechanisms of power. The divide is not between Republican and Democrat. It is a divide between the corporate state and the citizen. It is a divide between capitalists and workers. And, for all the failings of the communists, they got it. Unions, organizations formerly steeped in the doctrine of class warfare and filled with those who sought broad social and political rights for the working class, have been transformed into domesticated partners of the capitalist class. They have been reduced to simple bartering tools. The social demands of unions early in the 20th century that gave the working class weekends off, the right to strike, the eight-hour day and Social Security have been abandoned. Universities, especially in political science and economics departments, parrot the discredited ideology of unregulated capitalism and have no new ideas. Artistic expression, along with most religious worship, is largely self-absorbed narcissism. The Democratic Party and the press have become corporate servants. The loss of radicals within the labor movement, the Democratic Party, the arts, the church and the universities has obliterated one of the most important counterweights to the corporate state. And the purging of those radicals has left us unable to make sense of what is happening to us." It's not swearing and cussing that we need, necessarily, but we do need some old-style radical straight talking. Regards, Steve

Good response BJ. It's even longer than the OP though - you should have made it a post :-) "I’m not in the habit of opposing the defeat of small evils just because larger ones haven’t yet been dealt with." Nor am I. However, the evidence suggests that violence isn't the best way to go about it. http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/08/24/think_again_nonviolent_resistance?page=full# Regards, Steve

Really good post, BJ. The strategy in Libya was "bomb, bomb some more, wait, try diplomacy, bomb some more, hope it works." I fully expect the fall of Tripoli to be claimed as a stunning victory for this strategy - or more precisely the "bomb some more" bits. Regards, Steve.

Oops. Fixed. Sorry Cheryl. :-) Regards, Steve

You can apply the highlighted quote from Penny to Kenan Malik for a start off. Regards, Steve

Thought provoking stuff, John, and thanks for bringing it to our attention. The opposite viewpoint from the far Right's cries of "Euro-peons" every chance they get. Regards, Steve

Heh, nicely done as ever, H. Regards, C

More speculation: The Taliban spokes I linked above is linked to the haqqani group. Today Fazal Saeed Haqqani says his group has left the TTP and won't attack Pak anymore - just NATO. http://trunc.it/h6a9t Coincidence, or one of those "let those who have ears to hear" messages from the ISI? Regards, Steve

A 2.6 degrees Celsius rise is equivalent to a rise of 4.7 degrees Farenheit.

Indeed. Spot on post, guys. Regards, Steve

Thanks, empty. That article on Indian missteps is...well, way of the mark fits.

Joe Cirincione: "Just got off phone w expert who fears the worst yet to come #Fukishima. Here's USC analysis of meltdown: http://t.co/xJPu0QF "

Here's the ACLU's "Comparison of 2001 Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) and Proposed Expanded, Indefinite AUMF (H.R. 968, Section 7)" in PDF. I think that's as close are you're going to find, Dr. K, since its an amendment to and extension of the 2001 wording. Regards, Steve

Why do I think that Ford's motive in trashing virtual deterrence so that later he and other newocons can argue that Iran's virtual deterrent is just as much of a threat as a nuclear arsenal in being and should be bombed? Regards, Steve

Colm, are you under the impression I'm American? No, I'm Scottish. As to Pakistan's deaths: I have the greatest of sympathy for the victims and the common people of Pakistan - and yet it remains true that the bulk of those deaths have been caused by terror groups begun by the Pakistani deep state as its proxies, who then turned upon their patrons. That the same could be said of the US in no way changes the fact that Pakistan's elite must take a share of the blame for their own nation's dead or that Pakistan is now fighting a war on terror groups of its own genesis. Given that, I'd submit that the Pakistani state has no business playing the victim. Regards, Steve

I certainly wouldn't argue with you, empty and Tina - and we'd be wrong to follow Taylor's call to keep on short-terming the problem with bullying, as Bush did. I'm sure Bush and his folk didn't think in terms of repercussions for Armitage's threat a decade later, they just wanted to be seen doing something, anything, fast. But empty, analyzing the behavior of the Pakistanis in terms of an alliance is exactly what I'm saying should stop. Regards, Steve

I got nineteen, although I confess I almost second-guessed myself on Oman. Regards, Steve

Hi Lee, Do you have any supporting evidence for your assertions? I'm not saying you're wrong, but our traffic stats tell me you aren't posting from Libya, rather from the US. How do you know? Regards, Steve

Agreed with Lex. Anderson, you should do more of this kind of stuff. Regards, Steve

Yep, Obama's definitely delegated his FP to Hillary and her faction. I do think, though, that the GOP has the same problem the Dems had in 2004 and I think they'll go for the same solution: put up a "grey man" candidate who doesn't excite any part of the base against him too much but also doesn't excite the electorate to vote for him. Regards, Steve